Hedji's AM Build! I'm Gonna Need A Bigger Boat!

[Hedjii72]

I am so incredibly excited to at last be able to begin my own build, and my own build thread!

 

First, a little about myself.

 

I have been a Star Wars collector ever since 77, and it has been my dream to get my own TK armor since Star Wars Celebration II. In recent years, I have gotten into collecting prop replicas. I even put together a pretty accurate ANH 1:1 Vader costume:

 

 

I've worn it a couple of times, but it is truly built for display, not for trooping. As such, it is very uncomfortable. And I don't yet have contact lenses. So the costume sits in my basement as a display piece (much to the chagrin, I'm sure, of my local Garrison Excelsior members). I suppose sometime in the future I may mod it to make it more conducive to trooping, but for now, I'm much more interested in making my white armor dreams become a reality.

 

I am 6'2". Used to weigh about 215 lbs. Doctor warned me about my cholesterol, so now I am down to 180 lbs. So I will be a somewhat tall and lanky TK. Hope that's alright.

 

I've been a member of this forum for a while, but only recently have begun lurking more, and seriously researching which armor to buy. Because of my height, I went with AM armor, like a few others my size have posted. I'll begin by saying TrooperGear has been a fabulous guy to work with! He helped me with the finances, and delivered a well packaged product that is just fantastic. Every piece has been pre trimmed. And he graciously threw in a pauldron should I ever want to go down that road. Thanks, TrooperGear!

 

So, without further delay, here is my customary brown box photo:

 

 

 

Now for my customary plea for help! Help me FISD, you're my only hope!

 

I am... overwhelmed. Daunted. I am Chief Brody when he says, "You're gonna need a bigger boat!" (If you'll pardon a quote from another blockbuster 70s film.)

 

I've been reading and searching lots of AM threads, and the legendary Pandatrooper build thread is basically going to be my bible. I want to do the butt joins and cover strips to get that slimmed down ANH accuracy. But I need help with a few questions, and will most likely continue to rely on the good people of this forum for help as I go.

 

First, check out the size of these calf pieces!

 

 

That's my leg going through both halves of the calf piece. Look at how much room I have! I have rather skinny limbs, so there will be a lot of trimming involved. I've got some Lexan scissors, and an Ex-Acto blade, but I think I still need a basic box cutter style utility knife. The good news is I will have lots of extra plastic for snap plates.

 

On to my sizing concerns...

 

I'm planning on starting with the bicep pieces. When I put them on my arm to size them, do I nestle the piece without the raised strips inside, or vice versa? Here's a pic for what I mean?

 

 

 

 

 

But if I am to butt join the pieces, what gets trimmed and what doesn't? On one half of the bicep is the raised strip. Does that get trimmed anyway? Or does all the trimming happen on the side with no raised strip?

 

 

 

I have the same question with the forearms. Does the raised strip edge need to be preserved in order for the coverstrip to go over them, or do I try to trim equally on both parts?

 

 

Also, for the biceps and forearms, what trimming method is recommended? Score and snap? Or lexan scissors?

 

Another question. Do I glue both sides of the bicep and forearm assemblies, or do I glue only one side and leave the other side unglued and use velcro? I want to have an accurate, hopefully EIB-worthy build, but I also want it to be practical and sturdy.

 

In case you're wondering, I've already contacted my local Garrison leader. He's planning on giving me some help as our schedules permit. Do you think this is finish-able in time for Halloween? That is my goal, but we'll see...

 

Again, I am delighted to begin my hero's journey. From what I've seen, the people on this message board are incredibly helpful and generous. Hopefully, my questions and trials will help future troopers who are in my shoes, so I'll do my very best to document each step of my build.

[troopermaster]

If it was me building this kit, I would trim the raised edges to roughly half the size of the joining strips (15mm for arms - 20mm for legs) on all outer pieces and then trim the inner piecs to suit. It looks like you will be trimming a lot of plastic away so take your time and do it right

[RogueTrooper[TK]]

Hi Andy,

 

Ok the AM kit is made for the over lapped construction. In this pic (see below) you are over lapping the A and B part in the right way. and you will do the same for the forearms and thighs, if you are going to do it the over lapping way.

 

I did my AM build with the butt joint and used a cover strip ( by doing this, it gets the kit closer to the look of the screen used suits).

 

Cover strips for biceps and forearms are 13mm (measured off an original ANH TK) or you can go up to 15mm if you need to.

 

Cover strips for the Thighs, front and back are 23mm (measured off an original ANH TK)

 

Cover strips for the shins, front are 23mm, and back 25mm (measured off an original ANH TK)

 

 

There have been a few AM builds that have used the butt joint added cover strips method.

 

 

Here is a thread build that will help you out:

 

http://forum.whitear...am&fromsearch=1

 

[Hedjii72]

Thanks for the suggestions! After re-reading Pandatrooper's fantastic thread a few more times, I finally got enough courage to begin! Even made my first cut.

 

But I'm already questioning something regarding the AM biceps.

 

There is a formed ridgeline only on one piece of each bicep. Following Padatrooper's great tutorial, I have used a 8mm strip to mark that and cut the bicep leaving only 8mm of the ridgeline. Seeing as how the other half of the bicep has no ridgeline, am I correct in just butting the non-ridge piece up to the ridge piece, like this?

 

 

 

 

 

Or, if you like, I whipped up this diagram based on the existing method, to illustrate what I see happening. Does this make sense, or am I doing it wrong? The cover strip will simply lay over the 8mm ridge, and the side of the bicep with no ridge, shimmed inside also.

 

 

[RogueTrooper[TK]]

Hey Andy, you are doing it correctly in the same way that Panda did his. I took your pix and gave you a little diagram to go by (see below). The ridge area is actually something that was found on the ROTJ biceps, like the theory part of the diagram. The AM's are just suppose to be overlapping, but Panda used/kept the one side ridge of the AM bicep, which is fine.

 

 

In all actuality, the screen used ANH TK armor (then re-used in ESB) the biceps did not have the ridge on either end. See the diagram that I made showing an original screen use ANH bicep and my bicep. When I did my AM, I actually cut off the ridge and made it more in the vein of what the ANH and ESB biceps were like. I also took the time to remove the thumb print from the right bicep, it is not a necessary thing, just a pet peeve of mine, and just to see if I could do it. As far as I know, I am the only one that has done this to their AM biceps. (See below)

 

But I am actually helping someone who will be in my local Garrison do his build and we are doing his in the same vein as mine.

 

If you have already trimmed/fitted your bicep armor to your arm, then do not do what I did (remove the ridge) because your bicep will be too small for your arm.

 

 

[Hedjii72]

Tom,

 

Thank you so very much for such a well-articulated and visual response! I truly appreciate the time you took to compose that.

 

The (hopefully) good news is, I sized it very conservatively, leaving generous room. So I think I could get away with trimming the ridges clean off and then doing the coverstrip over them. I like the idea of having a pure ANH look to them.

 

I'm finding sizing the biceps to be challenging. I don't know what it should feel like. The hardest part of slipping them on is getting them over my elbow area. I have to do sort of a twist and then re-align it. Flexing my biceps doesn't seem to be a problem. I do want to be careful and make sure I don't cut off too much though.

 

Concerning the interior shims... do I make them out of the flat sheets of abs that came with the kit, or do I need to reserve those for cover strips only? I'd hate to run out. Am I better off using scrap pieces as interior shims or should I cut up a for sale sign?

Edited August 14, 2011 by Hedjii72

[RogueTrooper[TK]]

Hey Andy,

 

Happy to help.

 

About the way the AM biceps go on, you do have to twist them as you move them from your forearm to your bicep, eg, realign them.

 

Try to reserve the flat ABS sheets for your cover strips.

 

As for the backing strips or shims, use any scrap that you can or if you don't have enough scrap, then if you can find a reasonably thick/rigid "For Sale" sign, you can use that. If you can't find thick/rigid "For Sale" signs, then, you can glue a couple of "For Sale" signs together. This way they become more rigid. Just put an even amount of glue on the sheets and lay something heavy on top of them, eg. a piece of wood, books, etc. Then the "For Sale" signs will be thicker and more rigid. Then you can use this to make backing strips/shims that are not flimsy and not have to worry using the ABS sheets.

 

Or you can look on Amazon, Ebay or any type of hobby shop for small sheets of ABS or HIPS and order the small sheets to use as backing strips/shims.

 

 

BTW, I responded to you PM about the forearms.

[tkrestonva[TK]]

FWIW, I did mine the exact same way that Tom did, that is I cut the raised ridge completely off. I did so for both the biceps and forearms. Not only is it closer to ANH/ESB, but I found doing so makes the two halves line up a lot more cleanly.

 

As for the sizing, I think the key is you need to be able to fully flex your bicep - and of course be able to get it on and in place. If you can do that without the bicep being overly loose, you've gotten it right.

[Hedjii72]

A little bit of progress:

 

Here you can see I dremeled out part of the return edge on the forearms.

 

 

 

 

 

Perhaps I need to do more on the other side?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ordered and received my line 24 snaps and the snap setting tool. Not sure if I need to do the pliers. The pliers Wal Mart sells look like they're for a smaller size snap.

 

Also picked up some styrene for snap plates or inside shims (Which do you use the scrap trimmings on?)

 

 

And some glue for that:

 

[Hedjii72]

Here is how I trimmed the eyes and teeth on my AP Helmet. I'd really appreciate some feedback on this. I think I went fairly conservatively, but I'd like to know if I need to trim more out.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Please, any feedback would be most welcome! Having fun with the build.

Edited August 26, 2011 by Hedjii72

[tkrestonva[TK]]

I found it useful to use both the snap pliers (which you can get online or at JoAnn Fabrics) and the setter tool. The pliers are great for initially installing the snaps in the plastic tabs, but unless I reinforced it with the setter tool (and a good hammer), the snap held only weakly.

 

For the scrap trimmings, I used them for both the snap plates and the interior joining strips.

[RogueTrooper[TK]]

Hey Andy,

 

Looks like you are making some progress on your build. The sheet of Styrene will work great for the inside backing strips/shims and the snap plates. The Plastistruct plastic weld or any plastic welds that I have used, will weld the different plastics together, but I have found that they don't hold as well, unless the plastics are of the same material, eg. ABS to ABS, HIPS to HIPS, Styrene to Styrene, etc. The plastic weld is basically an acetone based product. What it does is melts the plastics that you apply it to. Once the liquid is dissolved it fuses the two plastics together. It works well if the plastics being fused are the same type, eg, ABS to ABS. I have done test and tried HIPS to ABS and it slightly fused them together, but the fusion did not have the strength as it would have, if it had been the same material being fused.

 

To glue the Styrene backing shims and the snap plates, you can use the E6000 or the Loctite Epoxy Heavy Duty High Strength Builders Formula, that sets in 5 minutes (UPC# 0 79340 68617 5). It is two squirt type bottles, that you mix equal amounts of Part A and Part B. You can find the Loctite at Home Depot and Lowes. The other one is the Loctite Epoxy Plastic Bonder, it works for just about any plastic and set in 20 minutes (UPC# 0 79340 68585 7).

 

The only reason I am telling you not to use the Plastic Weld on your snaps, is because they are going to have stress on them and you need extra strength to the bond for them. The E6000 will work just fine for the whole project, but if you want you can try the Loctite products.

 

 

As for doing the snaps, the pliers sometime work well and sometime don't. I have seen where the pliers kind of splits the material and the snap will not work correctly. If you use the pliers, test each one of the snaps, before gluing them into your suit. The method that I ended up doing was the hammer method with the tool that comes with the snaps. You just want to make sure that you are keeping the tool at 90 degrees, don't let it slant/angle on you. Don't focus on the actual snap itself when you are putting it into the setting tool. The snaps will always look a little off, until you start pounding the A and B parts together.

 

 

 

As for your AP faceplate, I think you need to trim out a little bit more around the eyes, not much (see pic below). As for your teeth, I think they are fine, don't take anymore meat off of them. I have seen a lot of people take off too much meat off the teeth and they lose their 3-D effect they should have to them. What I love about the ANH frown (I've coined the shark grin) the teeth are not straight or perfect and I think that is what makes them look so mean.

 

Here are a couple of links for some collages that I made of original ANH eyes and frowns that will help you out with this.

 

ANH Stunt and Hero eye reference:

http://forum.whitear...showtopic=16277

 

ANH Stunt and Hero frown/teeth reference:

http://forum.whitear...showtopic=16270

 

[Hedjii72]

Thanks, Tom. Looks like I'll just stick with the E-6000 for the whole thing then.

 

I'll have to get going on some snap plates. I ordered this snap tool http://www.ebay.com/itm/TOOLS-SETTER-Line-24-SNAPS-Tandy-Craftool-8058-snap-/140592089525?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20bbf109b5 but they didn't send me the anvil to hold the snap as you pound it.

[RogueTrooper[TK]]

Hey Andy,

 

You will need the metal anvil/base, or some type of flat metal so you can get a good strike on the snaps.

 

You can get the Snap tool at Michaels, Hobby Lobby, or A.C. Moore. Also, some fabric stores sell them as well, like Hancock.

 

The snap tools set is in the Leather tooling area of the craft stores. They are sold separately or with the snaps.

 

The kit below is like the kits that you can purchase from Fabric, and Hobby stores for about $10 dollars.

 

 

Hobby Lobby

900 Holt Road

Webster, NY 14580

(585) 872-7570

 

Michaels' Art and Crafts stores:

 

3349 Monroe Ave

ROCHESTER, NY 14618-5513

(585) 381-1670

 

40 Square Dr

VICTOR, NY 14564-1051

(585) 425-2140

 

500 Greece Ridge Center Dr

ROCHESTER, NY 14626-2823

(585) 368-0820

 

300 Hylan Dr

HENRIETTA, NY 14623-4216

(585) 424-3340

[Hedjii72]

Tom, you rock. Thanks, man!

[Hedjii72]

I've been working a little bit each day for weeks now. I gotta say, this is a LOT of fun! I used to put together a lot of figure model kits back in the day... monster models and stuff. This is like a giant model kit! But made to fit me. I am pretty, shall we say, meticulous, so I tend to work s-l-o-w-l-y.

 

 

Here are my biceps. The very first pieces I cut and glued. I erred on the side of loose with these, admittedly. Ignorant of how it'll all feel once it's strapped in, I played it safe. I'm sure many new troopers have done the same. The cover strips you see in the photo, I cut from the extra material provided with the kit (for an optional plastic belt). Stupidly, I cut all of my cover strips for the arms and legs at the same time. Unfortunately, once I taped them on, I noticed they are just slightly a different color of white, almost pinkish. It's not a dealbreaker, but I notice it. So I am in the process of carefully cutting new cover strips from the scraps that I trimmed off the arms and legs. I think I should have enough, but that leaves me with a lot less abs to make my snap plates from. I will use the sheets of styrene for my snap plates I guess. I dunno. What do you guys think? Should I just stick with the lovely cover strips I already cut?

 

 

 

Here are the forearms. Again, the cover strip you see is the slightly different color. Now that I look at the photos, maybe it's not that bad, but still...

 

 

The shins. I haven't trimmed off much of the return edge yet, because I want to wait for my boots. (TKboots is out of my size for a few weeks.)

[Hedjii72]

OK, as for fitting the torso, I've been a bit intimidated by this part.

 

Is this the right orientation for the kidney plate? I've looked at a lot of "Which Way Is Up for the Kidney Plate" threads, and it still is difficult to tell.

 

 

 

 

Here I am trying to draw the line for my kidney cut. I'm thinking my ab plate needs no trimming on the sides?

 

 

 

 

This really is difficult to do. As you can see, my butt plate is sagging. Am I not raising everything high enough?

[Hedjii72]

After removing the kidney plate and examining the line I'd drawn, I was discouraged to see it looked slanted instead of parallel.

 

 

 

(the line is photoshopped for enhancement) I guess I better try again.

[Hedjii72]

Let's switch gears and look at my AP Helmet progress. I'm fairly satisfied with it, considering it is my first ever helmet build. The ears, as predicted, were a bear. But I'm happy with how they ended up.

 

I have humbrol paints, a tube stripe template, and some s-trim on order from Trooperbay. Still need to get some better mic tips.

 

[Hedjii72]

As I was taking these photos, the DHL delivery man brought my SiMan/RS Props helmet! Couldn't help but take a comparison photo, just for fun.

 

[tkrestonva[TK]]

Cover strips look fine to me.

 

As for the torso, it can be difficult (at least it was for me) to properly judge which way is up for the kidney plate. I think you've got it right, but better to wait for a second/third opinion. Once you do decide, however, be sure to mark it appropriately - I have a "T" written via Sharpie on the inside near the top edge.

 

It doesn't look like you need to trim the ab plate at all. The cut line on the kidney plate shouldn't be slanted like that, it should be vertical. It looks like you are not properly lined up on the right side (as shown by your left side, the tops of the ab and kidney should line up), hence the slant. Also, if you leave yourself more room in the waist (making the waist a bit roomier than it needs to be), the butt should hang straighter. You can always add internal padding to the waist to get it snug.

 

Helmets look awesome - both of them.

[Hedjii72]

Thanks, Brian!

 

I hope to polish the helmet to bring out some more shine. Do you all paint first and then polish, or polish first and then paint? I wonder if a polished surface will help or hinder using a tube stripe template?

[TrooperTim]

Kidney plate looks correct side up. Cut the kidney plate straight, not slanted. This will allow the but plate to hang correctly from the kidney. I built my TK suit so that it's like a shell I slip into. It's cut to my body size but not form fitted to my body, if that makes sense. Looks like you're trying to cut the parts to form fit you, and I would suggest you not do this. As Brian said, you can add foam in places to fill in the gaps. Looks like you're about the right size like the actors who wore these in the films. The AM kit needs quite a bit of trimming but looks nice when it's done. Check out Pandatrooper's thread. He did a great job fitting AM armor to him. Sizing the pieces was the toughest part of the build for me. I redid my thighs a few times.

Edited September 14, 2011 by TrooperTim

[Hedjii72]

Solid advice, Tim! Thank you.

 

I did a preliminary cut of the kidney plate and just threw everything on that I could. It's all held together with tape and such, but I'm getting there. Please look at these critically and offer any feedback or criticism! Any glaring mistakes?

 

 

I know the chest piece needs to come way down, but I haven't trimmed that yet. Does the entire ab and cod piece need to come down too?

 

The thighs are a source of worry for me right now. I have very skinny legs, and wanted to avoid the "church bell syndrome" of having the thigh pieces way larger for my knees. So I trimmed them pretty tight. Perhaps too much. Do they look ridiculous? I know they have to be raised with straps still, but... I haven't glued the backs yet, so I'm thinking I might try to add an extra centimeter of comfort by leaving the back open a centimeter, shimming the inside, then covering it all up with the coverstrip. Would that work?

[Darth_Finger]

Right on Looking pretty good