ESB shoulder bridges

[tkrestonva[TK]]

I'm doing a review of the ESB CRL prior to it being published to Legion and I noticed that for the shoulder straps it says:

 

Shoulder Straps:

 

â– These shall be securely mounted in front and may free float in back. They may be affixed with rivets, Velcro, or adhesive.

â– No visible rivets are allowed.

â– These shall free float in back.

â– These shall be glued in front.

â– Straps shall not have a white elastic band securing the shoulder straps to either the chest/back.:

 

That last one surprised me, as it's a departure from ANH. I looked through dashrazor's high-res screen caps, and I didn't notice any elastic so it seems to be borne out. Still, the caps were a bit too fuzzy when you zoom in close to tell for sure. Anyone know the definitive answer, supported of course by the appropriate photo documentation?

[dashrazor]

well i am not 100% convinced that they free float in the back either

 

 

looks almost like ROTJ shoulder straps that were connected by velcro or glued front and back

 

 

here is the best photos i could find of the shoulders, not only is there no elastic, IMO they are fastened securely in the back not free floating

 

[tkrestonva[TK]]

I also noticed the way the backs seem to be permanently affixed versus free-floating. If that's truly the case then you would not be able to put the armor body on clamshell-style, you would have to pull the upper body on over your head like a tank top with the lower body held up by suspenders.

 

That would suggest a completely different strapping system from the ANH suits.

 

Since these were reused ANH suits, it doesn't seem plausible to me that the costume department would rework the strapping system.

[dashrazor]

velcro was used in the ROTJ suits, perhaps the same was used in ESB?

 

origonal rotj strapping

 

this is pretty much how my strapping is with the exception of the shoulder bells

[dashrazor]

if you look closely at the front attachment it is raised up from the armor slightly. this leads me to believe snaps or velcro was used to attach the shoulder straps after the armor was put on.

 

 

note the two troopers next to Leia

[dashrazor]

i know its blurry but it looks to me like a square (velcro?) just under the shoulder strap

[dashrazor]

more observations as i look closer the flat area seems to be cut off the shoulder strap on both the front and back on most troopers in ESB

 

several had tape holding the straps as well, perhaps the glued straps broke off after filming ANH?

 

 

[ZeroRoom[TK]]

This really throws a spanner in the works for this elf us wanting to build ANH and ESB by just getting an extra lid, gloves and belt! You'd need an extra chest plate/shoulder strap set as well

[tkrestonva[TK]]

Not necessarily.

 

The requirements are currently being tuned up by the staff to make them more clear and to correct mistakes. One of the ESB-specific changes being looked at is changing the shoulder bridge attachments from what they currently state to something like this:

 

03. Shoulder Straps:

 

These shall be securely mounted in front and may free float in back. They may be affixed with rivets, Velcro, or adhesive

No visible rivets are allowed.

These shall be affixed in the front (no snaps, rivets or brads shall be visible).

These shall be affixed in the back (no snaps, rivets or brads shall be visible).

A thin white elastic band securing the back of the shoulder straps, shall not be used.

 

The white elastic holding down the ribbed shoulder bridge in the back is ANH-specific, and can be worn or not worn depending on whether you choose to troop ANH or ESB on a particular day.

 

The word "affixed" allows for Velcro, which of course can be removed with a bit of effort, then reapplied later.

 

My suit is set up so that I have the shoulder bridges glued and sealed in the front, but I use a piece of white Velcro hidden under the flat part of each bridge in the rear that is mated to a patch of velcro on the backplate. Although I typically troop ESB, if I wanted to go ANH I simply pull the Velcro off the backplate (and I have plenty to spare) and slip the elastic bands back on.

[Daetrin[Admin]]

Good point Brian. I think you can still get away with it on the backs as you say by using or not using velcro to secure the backs.

 

There still is the velcro attaching the chest-back - you can see it here:

 

 

Some looseness here in the back here where the velcro detached?:

 

 

Also, it's hard to tell but I didn't see any evidence of the front crotch snap in all the screen caps I have - so maybe it's there, maybe not.

[FIVE[501st]]

Man, have I been asleep for 100 years... it feels like it! Just now catching up on all of this, and glad I looked. I'm finishing up my ESB, hoping for Centurion with it, and thought I'd check to make sure I had everything I needed... and wow, this is a big one to find! First saw it on the CRL, then was going to ask about it, but viola! there was already all of this write up. Like I said... 100 years.

 

I looked through all my screen grabs and this is a good call I think!

No elastic, and fastened in the back.

 

I will probably go Velcro to fasten mine because I love the clam shell assembly for getting into the armor.

 

Great job guys!

Good eyes!!!

 

One more thought... something else that you could possibly use if you wanted a "dual" ANH/ESB suit would be "Plasti-Tak" adhesive. It would hold — probably — pretty well, and yet would peal off easily.

[ZeroRoom[TK]]

 

The word "affixed" allows for Velcro, which of course can be removed with a bit of effort, then reapplied later.

 

 

Good point Brian. I have some of that sticky back velcor used for mounting signs, perhaps that's the way to go and still make it fairly easy to remove for ANH days...

 

 

 

Also, it's hard to tell but I didn't see any evidence of the front crotch snap in all the screen caps I have - so maybe it's there, maybe not.

 

That on the other hand is a little more tricky

 

A removable crotch brad could be hard without leaving any marks... Craft stores do sell sticky back stones not unlike brad tops. Perhaps a fake brad that can be stuck on when necessary is the way to go? The CRL does say that the brad need not be functional to be centurion ready...

[Sonnenschein]

Isnt there a sketch of the esb strapping by John Mollo on Jez's site?

[troopermaster]

Just remember these ESB suits are reused from ANH so the majority are going to be damaged in some way. The shoulder bridges are very fragile and probably the first thing to crack or snap off completely, so it's not surprising to see that many are held on with tape or riveted to get them though filming the scenes.

 

The suit you can see the velcro on is an ESB MKII which has both sides of the bridges velcro'd to the chest and back. It's possible velcro may have been applied to some of the reused ANH suits, thought I would hazzard a guess it wasn't.

[troopermaster]

Also, seeing how this is an advanced costume section, I can't see any reason to have fake brads or any other fake pieces. Either go the whole hog or stick with EIB Just my opinion

[Daetrin[Admin]]

Also, seeing how this is an advanced costume section, I can't see any reason to have fake brads or any other fake pieces. Either go the whole hog or stick with EIB Just my opinion

 

Sure enough. Can we presume the snaps are there on all suits? Just wondering as it seems at times I can spot them, at times not, but then my screen caps may not be high def enough.

[troopermaster]

I think it would be safe to assume that all the hardware on the ANH suits are present on the suits reused in ESB, but not on the new ESB MKII's.

 

If you cannot see certain things then it's possible that area may have been modified before or during production. Any chance you can post up the pics of these suits without the snaps/brads?

Edited May 30, 2011 by troopermaster

[ZeroRoom[TK]]

Also, seeing how this is an advanced costume section, I can't see any reason to have fake brads or any other fake pieces. Either go the whole hog or stick with EIB Just my opinion

 

Sorry Troopermaster - I wasn't endorsing fake/non functional brads per se - I was just pointing out that if the ESB Centurion requirements were to change to eliminate the crotch brad it would make the option of building an ANH / ESB interchangeable suit that much harder without solving the crotch brad is there / crotch brad isn't there issue. All the current interchangeable stuff is relatively easy to accommodate to switch between the two but a split rivet driven through your crotch plate isn't quite as easy to swap as a pair of gloves or a holster...

 

Apologies for not making myself clearer, but I'm definitely a fan of the ability to choose depending on mood

[FIVE[501st]]

Also, seeing how this is an advanced costume section, I can't see any reason to have fake brads or any other fake pieces. Either go the whole hog or stick with EIB Just my opinion

What?! This is crazy talk! Who are you? What have you done with the real Troopermaster?!

 

 

Ahhh... I crack myself up sometimes.

(only sometimes)

[TK bondservnt[501st]]

I personally think that having the ANH/ESB rig setup should not have this variation for shoulder straps.

if you do a lineup of every trooper in ESB, I'd have to ask someone like TM... how many ESB mark II's were there in ESB?

 

what would be the ratio for modified shoulder straps in esb? 50 50? 20 80?

 

having the shoulder straps glued down, and free in back or floating in back and having the rear large tab cut off

seems to be the variations seen in ANH and ESB in my opinion.

 

has anyone really noticed that the rear LARGE tab is cut off on most suits in these two films!

 

on some suits both large tabs are removed. there is a lot of variation in the construction of the

chest / back on the first 2 films.

Edited June 6, 2011 by TK Bondservnt 2392

[ZeroRoom[TK]]

TKrestnova's Velcro solution sure helps the variation switch and swap, but I'm glad you bring up the tabs because thats the big one. If cut tabs became CRL required for ESB it really would mean you'd need two sets of shoulder straps and proabably two chest and back pieces...

[TK bondservnt[501st]]

I personally think that changing this CRL does not really represent the variables seen on screen.

having velcro, tape or glued down completely would cover both films quite well.

 

large tab in front and no large tab in the rear, with ANY of the options listed above would be much better.

 

the only major variation is free floating with white elastic as the variable for ANH.

 

so to make anh/esb versions would simply require no white elastic and velcro or tape to hold down

the rear for the ESB variation.

Edited June 7, 2011 by TK Bondservnt 2392

[Exploderator]

I noticed the CRL was updated to match what was said here. However there is a contradiction. Or am I misunderstanding? I was about to do this part of my armor and was double checking.

 

"03. Shoulder Straps:

 

* These shall be securely mounted in front and may free float in back. They may be affixed with rivets, Velcro, or adhesive.

* No visible rivets are allowed.

* These shall be glued in front.

* These shall be affixed in the back (no snaps, rivets or brads shall be visible).

* Straps shall not have a white elastic band securing the shoulder straps to either the chest/back."

 

"09. Chest:

 

* Chest plate overlaps the abdominal plate.

* Chest and back shall be connected with a white fabric or preferably elastic strap at the shoulders."

[tkrestonva[TK]]

No contradiction. The white elastic band in Section 03 refers to the band that goes over the shoulder bridge and is ANH-only, as seen below:

 

 

ESB troopers do not have this.

[Exploderator]

So for ESB the straps are both affixed front and back AND have white elastic underneath between chest and back plates?