What is wrong with the Disney armor?

[Bernard]

I know I must be crazy to ask for this here but I do need to know. I have been working for Disney making Star Wars armour since 2004. We make their Stormtroopers, Clone troopers, Darth Vader, Zam Wessel, Captain Rex, Commander Cody, Boba Fett and the Amidala headdress. I have often heard complaints about the lack of accuracy in our suits in this forum. Often these cannot be avoided due to the restrictions placed upon us by Disney. But I think there are others mistakes which I would like to address and correct. Please let me know what changes would have to be made to have our Disney suits be 501st approved. I have attached photos. Please be kind but thorough.

[FIVE[501st]]

For one, I think it's awesome you're posting here! I mean how cool would it be if the Disney armor ended up being actually GOOD!!!

 

There are a lot of little things you can do to make it better. For one, you're all mixed up on what "version" you're doing. Is it ANH, ESB, or ROTJ? The "edge" on the armor makes it seem ROTJ, but the hand plates and frown color are ANH.

 

Things I would change that don't include completely re-sculpting it all are...

1. Get accurate colored "tube stripes".
2. Change the lenses to be green flat lenses.
3. Change out the "ab plate" buttons so they're smaller, colored correctly, and in the ANH position.
4. Make the eyes and "frown" bigger.
5. Try fixing the size of the gray "traps" on the helmet... they're a bit small too.

 

That's basic "quick fixes" that could do a LOT!

 

Look at------------here and study the films like we do... endlessly. Check out--------- to find out what armors we choose from as 501st and which ones we stay away from.

 

There are a lot more things you could do... remove the edges, put "return edges" on the shoulder bells, and stuff like that. Personally I'd scrap the helmet and start over there... it's the most iconic important part and when it doesn't look JUST right it looks REALLY wrong. Even when people can't put their finger on why.

 

Hope that helps!

I'm sure I'm not the only one who will reply!

Edited January 30, 2021 by gmrhodes13
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[GosHawk[501st]]

I recently went to dland and watched the Jedi training thing fun show btw. I was sitting rather far away so I couldn't nit pick the only thing that was noticable was the shoulderbells they needed to be closer to the chest armor, maybe the straps are wearing out or something I don't know lol.

[bluehickey]

A lot of it comes down to knowing which armor features come from which film in the trilogy. As was mentioned above, there is a conglomerate of different smaller details that are specific to an individual movie that are occurring within the Disney armor.

For example the soles of the boots are black in ANH and ESB, but are white in ROTJ. So if the Disney armor has the white soled boots and the trim on the armor, then it most likely represents the armor in ROTJ, which would mean that the frown should be painted black and not grey.

 

Although the helmet does have it's quirks, I will admit that it is better than the FX helmet that most of the 501st troopers wear when marching in the parade!

Here is an accurate helmet for reference:

----------

 

The Disney helmet could be improved by:

-smaller, blue tube stripes

-more accurate mic tips

-grey cheek traps instead of black

-3 screws added to each ear (if they aren't already there)

-perhaps make the eye opening bigger/wider (this can only help the people in costume also be able to see more)

 

As for the armor, besides what has already been mentioned above:

-the drop boxes should be hung with white straps not black

-Holsters? It would be great to see some leather holsters riveted to the belt!

Edited January 30, 2021 by gmrhodes13
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[TK:TK]

I appreciate the challenges there must be to create a costume that can survive on stage and provide maximum mobility for performers. You have my respect - I can scarcely handle a staircase wearing my armour.

The Disney armour veers a bit off course because, like FX armour, it's an artistic interpretation of the stormtrooper. It hits all the big features, but it lacks the troopers' essence. I would think audiences would pick up on this.

 

First off: lose the helmet. Can't sugarcoat it. It looks like a Rubies. The eyes and dome shape are off. The bridge of the nose/snout seems pushed in too.

 

The breastplate is off in a curious kind of way. The sides are cut too wide. Reads more like a tank top than a breastplate. And the cod piece is kind of cut too wide as well. The overall effect is that the troopers look more like they're wearing white leotards than armour.

(Probably not great for instilling fear in the masses).

 

If these suits have to be designed for maximum mobility, maybe they ought not to be made of hard plastic (heresy, I know).

Go for 100% accuracy, but reconsider the material. Perhaps a semi-rigid plasticized foam with great memory might fit the bill (at least for the armpits and hips). How it's done, I leave to others of a higher pay-grade than I....

 

Good luck...

[FIVE[501st]]

If these suits have to be designed for maximum mobility, maybe they ought not to be made of hard plastic (heresy, I know).

Or maybe they should look into troopermaster's flexible armor.

[vecspeed12]

this is very cool

[TK-J]

Well, this is the look that you see all the TK's in the new games with. ROTJ armor, ANH helmet and handguards. I think I've read somewhere that this is GL's definitive looking TK.

Honestly, I've seen worse looking and fitted kits than those approved over the last couple years.

Edited June 16, 2010 by TK-J

[naatsirhc[TK]]

Wow! I would love to see the Disney armor re-worked, it really bothers me every time I see the jedi training show. I went yesterday for my birthday, my daughter finally got picked and faced Darth Vader. I asked one of the tech guys why the suits were mixed up between ANH and ROTJ, his reply " those are screen used suits from LFL". He went on to say that they only have 4 suits and LFL checks w/ them regularly to make sure they still have them, they are stamped inside someplace LFL. The guy was really convinced that these were real trooper suits, I found this very disturbing. It think it is great that you are considering making better armor. I think all of the actual armor issues are covered above, but I would like to say something about strapping. I really do not like the fact that you see the clips holding the thighs up and the shoulder strapping needs to be reworked. My 2 credits!

Thanks

[Laspector[TK]]

That pic of the disney suit from behind looks like shoes instead of boots. WTF?

[Daetrin[Admin]]

I'd agree that there is some mix and matching between movie versions - this is a mostly an ROTJ suit with ANH hands & helmet details. If you really want to go ROTJ then getting the helmet and hands to match would be a good first step, and those ab plate buttons are just plain huge.

 

It would be helpful to know if there are any constraints put on you by LFL.

 

For 501st approval, you can see the requirements lists here:

 

-------------

 

Hope this helps, and great seeing you here

Edited January 30, 2021 by gmrhodes13
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[trooper18938]

I have seen these suits in person, and while not accurate, there have been modifications necessary for the performers. Most notably, the eyes and tears have been cut out and replaced with black screen - so that there is more air circulating in the bucket. It is hot, humid FLA, after all. While green lenses may be accurate, they would fog up - besides, how many of us have heard a Clone being called a Stormtrooper? Disney is a fantasy world, and most people there couldn't tell one from another.

[Dmian]

I'd go more towards a ROTJ armor than a ANH armor.

I think ROTJ is more suitable for the task, as it's smaller and has the "lip" on the edge, that makes it safer for the performers. An accurate ANH armor is a bit uncomfortable, and the unprotected edges are a real threat!

So, just changing the handguards for the correct ROTJ ones, painting frown correctly (black and overlapping the teeth area) and the ab buttons too (smaller, with a black/dark blue scheme) and applying the correct decals to the helmet (tube stripe section) will make a lot for accuracy.

The links Paul put for the CRLs are the #1 source of information.

Cheers.

[Plastic Fury[TK]]

This is really cool to see, just got done marching at Star Wars Weekends, four weekends in a row! We often have these discussions when we are in line and see the Disney TK's heading up to the gate, pre-march. The suits definitely have that ROTJ look over all, not much I can say that has not been said but it would be awesome to see some changes made where they can be.

[Rich330[TK]]

I asked a Scottish friend on his opinion and he said it all comes down to one thing ...

 

"Some armours look screen accurate but the Disney ..... disney (sic)"

[JoeR]

The thing is to a lot of the general public a stormtrooper is an FX or a TE and they can't tell the difference. Not everyone examines troopers to a crazy level like the geeks around here.

 

I think it is great that Brian is coming here for advice.

 

Joe

[FIVE[501st]]

The thing is to a lot of the general public a stormtrooper is an FX or a TE and they can't tell the difference. Not everyone examines troopers to a crazy level like the geeks around here.

I agree there are a great number of people who don't notice the difference... I don't think they "can't tell" though. Mention something and they'll see it.

 

That being said (and I know that's what you mean) I still content the majority of people already DO tell the difference!

 

The first time I wore my TE2 in public I got the most random people — old, young, short, tall, educated (seeming), uneducated (seeming) — all saying things like, "Why do you look better than them?" "Your armor is different... why?" and so on. People may not know what they're seeing is different, but they know something is different. One old lady said of an FX bucket, "His head's too big." She got it.

 

I think it's like high-def televisions. There are guys (I know one of them) who would snarf at a TV that I thought was "good enough." I know nothing about what's good and what's not... and am certainly not on TV forums and the like. But if you sat one that I thought was "good enough" next to the one that the TV geeks would drool over, I bet I could say, "That one's better and this one sucks." I may not know all the techie specs, but I'd be able to see it.

 

Thus it is with TK armor. People know it even when they don't know it.

 

Okay... off to the For Sale forum to post a used soap box.

[xxcombzxx]

i dont know much about storm trooper armor like the rest of everyone here, however i do my research as much as i can. but damn that Disney helmet looks so bad they really need to scrap it and buy a better quality one. look at the traps (there solid black) the tube stripes (black not blue) i cant even put my finger on it but that whole helmet just does not look right.

[littledragon88[TK]]

Hi there! Thanks for stopping by the FISD. I remember reading a thread just like this over at the replicapropforum from a guy who also worked with these suits.

 

As with what people have said before, I also think you should stick with the ROTJ styled armor concerning the performer's comfort and mobility. IMO the following changes would drastically improve the accuracy of the suit:

 

1) The shoulder bell should be cut shorter so it doesn't overlap the biceps like it does now.

2) Improve the helmet by redoing the face plate, especially the front. I would suggest to use reference pictures from www.starwarshelmets.com

3) Redoing the chest plate so it doesn't overlap the abdomen plate, this will also improve basic mobility for the performer.

 

Although there are changes I'd like to see to be made, I must admit I think you've done a great job with the back.

 

I did remember seeing the Disney suit in person when we were working on the Star Wars The Exibition in Sweden. I did remember it being very sturdy and stiff (fiber glass), one of our troopers also helped the staff do some repainting of the helmet (using the correct blue for the tube stripes etc).

[MiDri]

i dont know much about storm trooper armor like the rest of everyone here, however i do my research as much as i can. but damn that Disney helmet looks so bad they really need to scrap it and buy a better quality one. look at the traps (there solid black) the tube stripes (black not blue) i cant even put my finger on it but that whole helmet just does not look right.

 

I agree, scrap helmet -- talk to Cap, AP, Gino, TE2, TM, or ATA and see if you guys can acquire a nice mold. Probably won't, but maybe just maybe one of them would be willing to help out Disney for say... lifetime passes? lol

[Shovelheadjedi]

WOOOW!!! i seriously have been wondering about this topic for some time. but always for got to ask!!!! very very good topic!!!!

[idejducman[TK]]

I would like to make a comment on a post made earlier. First let me just say that it is great that someone at Disney wants more accuracy with thier costumes. I am not going to comment on the Disney TK's. It would just be redundant.

I have to say though that alot of Troopers are bashing the FX Armor. Maybe you are all newer members to the 501st. But you have to remember that that WAS THE ARMOR to have. There was nothing else out there at the time. I have owned many FX armor suits since 1997-98 and if you owned that, you were in. It was the only option. It is understandable that with the new talent out there, there are many options now in Armor Choices. However, armor is not cheap. Many troopers or elders have the FX Armor. Lets remember that if it were not for those crafty people that created the FX armor, the 501st would not be where it is today. Respect the FX armor and its owners.

[FIVE[501st]]

Respect the FX armor and its owners.

Good points man. I think that respect is there for sure... we (I'm saying we because I'm one of them) just know that NOW there are so many better choices to start with. So it's all relative.

 

I respect YOU though for using the correct version of "its" in that respect sentence!!!

[idejducman[TK]]

I do agree. There are alot of choices. I do not regret buying FX armor in the past, but I would surely look at other armor now.

[FIVE[501st]]

I do agree. There are alot of choices. I do not regret buying FX armor in the past, but I would surely look at other armor now.

Yep... 100% same page brother!