ObiHahn

Congrats, Tom! And welcome to the ranks. One last thing: There were screen-used troopers with one or two male snaps in the butt plate, but never with 2 female snaps on the corresponding elastic (according to my reference, that is). So all you had to do was add an additional snap on the butt plate, NOT the elastic. The one on the elastic is supposed to be snapped into one of the two male snaps on that butt armour, counter-intuitive as that might be. Oh well.

Just chiming in real quick since I built this suit. The knee is installed in a perfectly screen accurate way. Checking my references, these are just two of many ANH screen-seen TKs with knee placement way more off than what I replicated on Tom's suit: That's how screen accurate knee parts tend to sit if you line them up to be straight looking head-on at the shins. For a program like Centurion, shouldn't screen TKs be the be-all-end-all reference? Just something for y'all to think about. Not intent on starting yet another "FISD and screen accuracy" discussion here, but denying Centurion status because of a slightly crooked knee that clearly has lineage to what we see in the movie? Yeah, after endless discussions about allowing FX for Centurion, this kinda sits wrong with me and the "let's do things like they were on the actual movie costumes" crowd... No doubt about the rivets though, those should be replaced. Tom will do that as soon as he sourced the correct kind/size split rivets. Not the easiest of tasks here in Germany.

They look awesome painted, Paul. Now wear them so it all rubs and chips off again!

Congratulations, Thomas. I see you are still wearing it very well! About the shoulders: Tom is a very tall guy with very broad, "heroic" shoulders. There's 2 options for strapping them. The 1st is how he wears them now, with a little give in the black strap on the bells so the snaps will not come off and the white elastic under the shoulders will never be pulled out, it remains invisible. The 2nd option would be to shorten the black straps, but risk the snaps coming loose once in a while, as well as occasionaly pulling out the white shoulder elastic. The shoulders on a couple movie troopers were like Tom wears them here - that should always be the reference.

I approve of this information. About time, though.

Little piece of information: Rob and Si of RS Props are staying over at my place in Germany this weekend for the MovieDays convention in Dortmund, they'll be back in the UK on monday. Prices are on their website, but I'm sure you already found that out. And waiting for a reply for over one day is more than usual in this hobby. Patience, young padawans! So what's it gonna be then, Paul: PVC or ABS?

It all boils down to if you want hyper-accurate and original materials to go with the original molds or if you prefer slightly idealized material and a bit more flex and high gloss for trooping. Ultimately, it's entirely your call. But it always helps to see things in context of lineage and screen accuracy.

Not to derail this thread completely, but it has been established in the TK prop nut community for quite some time now that the "painted vs. unpainted suits" theory stemmed from the fact that Simon's suit has been painted after production wrapped. Painted stormtroopers have since been debunked, even by Brian Muir himself I believe - have to check that again though. J.W. Rinzler's making of book does not mention painting the suits either. It's a one time thing on Si's suit and was misinterpreted by a whole lot of people. According to the logic of painting what was white plastic to begin with white (time-consuming and not cost-effective), all surviving ABS hero helmets accounted for these days should also be painted to match the painted suits, and not one of those shows even the slightest hint of paint. Also, if they did paint the suits white, why would they use another shade of white that so clearly contrasts the painted stunt HDPE helmets? No armor suit was ever painted white, other than maybe after filming ended. Both of your 2007 LFL archive pics taken by Matt Gauthier for the Ainsworth court case show unpainted ABS suits. The sheen of the ABS is very obvious in both of those archive pics. Check the upper left (looking at the pic) torso split rivet for the white paint smeared around the rivet head, and over the otherwise unpainted surrounding ABS, it's clearly just painted rivets in unpainted plastic, with a visible difference in the 2 shades of white. The shin shows what I believe is residue either from being re-glued the wrong way around, or just residue of tape to quickly close the shins (maybe for ESB). The shade of residue is too yellow and it's raised vs recessed, chipped off paint. Also, paint never chips in such straight, controlled lines like we see on those pics.

Oh, and here's a couple pictures taken that glorious day. Because no, I did not make that up. I made a trip to visit RS Prop Masters last year with my best TK bro R2Dan, and the guys were giving us the opportunity to finally fulfill a lifelong dream. Such great guys, the both of them. Matter of fact, Rob&Si are coming over to pay us a visit in Germany this coming weekend and to attend MovieDays in Dortmund. The detonator in question: Me checking out the original armour: Me wearing the helmet, front torso and arm parts. R2Dan even got to wear the whole shebang because he actually fit into what was built for rather short and slim stunt guys/extras back in the day. Oh, and also, we met Brian Muir - what a great guy.

Simon's suit has been painted by him when he was a kid, not by the art department back in 1976. No ABS suit or hero helmet seen on screen has been painted, only the HDPE helmets for obvious reasons. When I had the honor to visit Rob&Si to see (and even partially wear) the original suit I removed an endcap from the original detonator, which Simon kindly allowed me to do, so we could find a spot that has hardly discolored since it never got dusty or exposed to direct sunlight. Comparing that to their ABS material showed that it was as close a match as you could hope for over 30 years later.

Keep in mind that you will get the exact same shape of armour. Pulled from the same moulds made from an original ANH armour. PVC is pure white and high gloss, that's what makes it a bit more idealized and "prettier" to the public eye. It's the only "sanitized" detail about the PVS suit, if you will. ABS is more for accuracy purists since the shade of slightly off white, more satin ABS the RS guys use is a perfect match of the original ABS used for the prop/costume back then. I know, I checked in person. Also, PVC is more flexible and thus the better choice for trooping on a regular basis. This pic might help. 2 RS kits, PVC on the left, ABS on the right. Normal room lamp, the difference is most noticeable with flash photography, but not so much in direct sunlight. Sunlight really brings out the gloss of the PVC, though.

Excellent idea: put the spotlight on this matter. By the way, I gladly offer my help for all small things and nuances of screen accurate ANH TKs for any possible future "hardcore" artisan programs. I can make lists in English and German.

Hm, that's difficult. I'd say all armor that, when you overlay the single components (like thigh/calf halves, arm halves, shoulders, chest etc.), say in different Photoshop layers, and the form and outlines match up to a high degree to screen used/derived components, it should be eligible for Centurion. In my mind, that includes all directly 1st gen cast armor and helmets, all TE clones (I'm calling them that to simplify, not to stir up another recasting debate) and all fan sculpts that are so well observed and implemented that they basically resemble screen derived armor. While this is talking subtleties no doubt, so is pointing out types of rivest used or placing of snaps and such, and well...has been massively overlooked so far when it should be the most important factor in aiming for a screen accurate look. A TM without rivets, snaps and the whole shebang will always look more like a trooper from the movie (I'm talking silhouette, character or "mojo" here) than a set of FX/AM armor all decked out in what our current Centurion CRLs demand, I think we might all agree on that.

I'd say: if it has all the subtle characteristics of screen used suit (like I said: curvatures, details, proportions), we should consider it equally accurate. My personal experience: laying TM and RS armor pieces next to each other/stacking them into each other shows that they are only different by sooo sooo few millimeters, it would not be a wise move to exclude Paul's work from such a program. It's what bothers me about less accurate fan sculpts: they're not well observed and replicated. TM surely is, in nuances that sometimes frighten me.

That about sums it up, Damian. Would be a way to go in the future.