SlyFox740

Aside from the dye tells in the nylon webbing I wanted to show more evidence that proves the more common USGI issued OD Green A.L.I.C.E. Pack was used and not the rare black one issued to special task forces. The fact alone that they're common enough to be sold in surplus stores makes it pretty obvious that's what was sourced for the props. But just to be thorough I wanted to point out that the thread used to sew these packs is also OD Green so If you look closely at the stitching ANYWHERE on the screen used A.L.I.C.E. Pack you'll notice that it's still OD Green as it obviously did not take very well to the dye.

You're very welcome! Looking forward to hearing your thoughts The found part I have identified for the Antenna Cable does look to be very accurate though I am actually still pursuing it further to see If I can possibly find an even closer match in terms of wall thickness, but I am convinced Latex Surgical Tubing is correct. Fuel line sounds like it could be tough to work with but It's definitely a possibility, and 5.5mm is definitely not far off from my measurements. I edited my post about the surgical tubing 'Antenna Cable' on the last page, go back and read it when you get a chance. Because latex tubing is so stretchy I should mention it is actually possible to collapse latex tubing into a concave profile if stretched & wrapped too tightly. Though I do not believe the prop maker would purposely deform the wrapped tube if he intended it to look like an electrical cable. Latex tubing is VERY stretchy! It's actually the same type used for slingshots but the 5mm kind is used for that purpose. I did consider this initially, but due to the consistency of color ultimately I dismissed the possibly of the flat black finish being caused by weathering alone. There does seem to be some kind of dust or powder on the entire antenna assembly and dried up stains of some kind on the tubing or something of that nature. Brian if you feel compelled to investigate the fuel line I encourage you to do so. As I said fuel line might be tough to manipulate and wrap around the pole and/or tough to thread through the eyes of the fishing rod, but I could be wrong on that. It's hard to say without further research, at the very least you would be helping eliminate another possibility off the list. I currently have two more additional sizes of Latex Surgical Tubing being shipped to me with differences in wall thickness. I also considered ordering tubing meant for crafting/making necklaces,ect. which appears to be flat black but it turns out that is also just latex tubing only a different size. Thank Mr Paul! I'm fairly confident I have identified the correct part, though as I said I am still pursuing it further to see If I can find a closer match in terms of wall thickness which I believe affects the wrap profile. But I am convinced Latex Surgical Tubing is correct. I also do not believe there was any type of 'wire' running through the tube, it's unnecessary and shouldn't be needed to "keep the tube in place". Especially with Latex Surgical Tubing as I stated before it's extremely easy to work with, very soft and simple to manipulate even after it's wrapped! Though many types of tubing are not like this, some kinds of rubber are actually very stiff. So I can see how that idea could be considered by someone trying to recreate this antenna. Also about the Hot Glue, I thought it was the same thing! I'm thinking it was actually meant to hold the end of the tube inside the Norwegian Grenade Case or "Ammo Box" like that of the Hot Toys action figure as shown earlier. Perhaps it's possible the glue fell off the CE Pack prior to being put on display, then they stuffed the end of the tube into the lower webbing patch on the side of the ALICE Pack only to ultimately fall out and hang down for the rest the event while on display.

Great Job finding the correct fishing rod guys, I ordered one as soon as you posted that and got to work on my antenna build. I noticed on your last post the tubing you used looks rather shiny or gloss black (seen below), where as the one on the CE prop doesn't appear to look that way. Its more flat black like the way an actual electrical cable looks. Also you can take this as you will, it's just my personal opinion but I honestly believe the tubing has a slightly thicker outer diameter than 5mm. I agree that the tubing profile stays convex when wrapped and should not collapse into a concave shape. But where it's wrapped around the fishing rod the space between each coil should be approximately the same width as the tube itself. Wrapping the coils this close together while still ending up with the correct amount of coils is key! I've also noticed already that people are having a bit of trouble getting the wrap the way they want, or they're having some difficulty manipulating the tubing the way that it is on CE Pack anyways. Also in the Antenna cable post ireachy said: "As you can see in the pic above mr paul’s v2.0 antenna wraps still need some tidying :)" but wrapping the antenna can be difficult to do neatly depending on what type of tubing you're using, some kinds can actually be quite difficult to manipulate the way you want without kinking or collapsing the tube. Though I found there is one type of tubing in particular that is very easy to manipulate, even after it's wrapped! And it is also Flat Black in color, not gloss black. I think I may have actually pinpointed the exact kind of tubing used for the antenna cable, I personally believe it to be the same item as the found part used for the R1 packs. Well I believe I have found the same type and size, the name brand is absolutely hopeless without getting confirmation from the prop maker who actually put the packs together himself. And even he may not know as this tubing often comes on a blank spool with no logos at all, it's a very generic item! Thankfully even though this type of tubing may be made by several different manufacturers and distributed under many different name brands they're basically all the exact same thing, I feel it's more a matter of the finding correct type and size than brand since it is such a generic item. It would be nice to know and all but it really doesn't matter all that much in the end as they all look exactly the same and you can't visibly tell one brand apart from the next. Before I get to the type of tubing I found I will show my observations; First off, notice the tubing is right next to the CAM buckle on the CE pack, very close if not touching! Also if you look very closely you can see that the tubing is the exact same width as the front wall on the CAM buckle not including the bottom base plate. Both of the red "H" shapes I put on the image are identical size copies. When measuring the CAM buckles I found and identified here: http://www.whitearmor.net/forum/topic/38162-rogue-one-stormtrooper-back-pack-part-found/?p=526246 The front wall is about 1/4" or 6mm (not counting the thickness of the base plate) By laying the known found parts I already Identified on top of my iPad Pro I was able to scale the image of the CE Pack. As you can see the tubing seems to be about 1/4" or 6mm in diameter. The tubing I have found and identified is Black Latex Surgical Tubing 1/4" O.D. 1/8" I.D. 1/16" W. The "W" stands for Wall Thickness. Black Latex Surgical Tubing is flat black in color just like an electrical cable. It comes in 5mm Diameter too which I also ordered, but as I said before; when wrapping the tubing the space between each coil should be about the same width as the tube itself. And it should still end up with the correct amount of coils, this is important! Surgical Latex Tubing is very easy to manipulate and wrap. It's very soft and stretchy so it's fairly simple to thread it through the eyes of the fishing rod with the help of needle nose pliers. All in all it's VERY easy stuff to work with! Which makes me suspect prop makers in the movie industry may have been using this trick for a while as it is also much cheaper on the budget to buy lengths of tubing than actual cable with real wires in it. Notice how the tubing is pinched at the eyes of the fishing rod just like on the CE Pack. Latex tubing is VERY stretchy! It's actually the same type used for slingshots but the 5mm kind is used for that purpose. Because of this I should mention it is actually possible to collapse latex tubing into a concave shape if stretched & wrapped tight enough. Though I do not believe the prop maker would purposely deform the wrapped tube if he intended it to look like an electrical cable. Here is where I ordered my tubing from, it's more than sufficient length: http://www.ebay.com/itm/190607486059

Sorry to "derail" but actually I was only responding to an earlier post and providing evidence to back up my statements. Furthermore it was directly related to wearing the R1 TK Pack with your OT TK just like you Mr Paul, more specifically wearing it at an official event. Might not be about building the prop but definitely something on the minds of those who are building them, like myself. Anyways my apologies... Move Along, Move Along.

I don't completely disagree with you because I know how Disney and Lucasfilm can be in certain cases, but on the other hand complete accuracy is not always a requirement is some cases. I have a friend who trooped a Kylo Ren costume on the premiere of TFA that was not exactly screen accurate. And to be specific on the topic of OT TKs being represented as R1 TKs Disney kind of seems to be all over the map right now at this point. At least in terms of action figures, and I realize when it comes to costuming it's a bit of a different story, especially with official Disney events/locations. There are also aspects of design & production costs/saving when it comes to toys as the designs, molds and other production processes have already been set up, tested and successfully launched before. All that is really needed is a new packaging design. I realize this is probably why the new details were seen as negligible minor differences and completely omitted on some figures and on others seen as important defining details and include all new changes in great accuracy. As you can see here, this is an 18" Rogue One Stormtrooper Figure from the "Big-Figs" series made by Jakks Pacific. The Helmet and Armor are OT as you can see, OT Ab buttons, No flashlight on the blaster ect, ect. The whole figure and blaster is actually quite accurate to ANH. But this is probably because this not a "New" figure, Disney released this exact same figure already before with different Star Wars Rebels themed packaging, they also made the same figure in a 31" size with the same Star Wars Rebels themed packaging. I own both 18" and 31" versions. Even more interesting on the other hand they obviously do care about accuracy somewhat because at that time when they were first released some and I do mean only some of these figures were also released with a cartoon style head in which the helmet looked exactly like the Rebels animated series they were meant to represent. But then the body armor was still OT style not animated? kind of weird looking figure actually and even further evidence that Disney is all over the map and does not always require complete accuracy. Obviously none of these "New" Rogue One figures will have this animated style head seen below. Here is a comparison photo of the two different heads on the same body side by side. OT helmet on the left, Rebels animated series helmet on the right. Now on the other hand and to prove that Disney is truly all over the map with the accuracy in Lucasfilm Licenced toys. I must also point out there is a new Rogue One 12" (1:6 scale) figure made by Hasbro in which all the new R1 armor details seem to be represented quite accurately. All in all very accurate except for one small detail on the blaster which actually seems to be taken from an existing E-11 mold designed for another 1/6th scale stormtrooper figure. A smaller version of the exact same blaster for a 1/12th scale figure also exists. I have this Rogue One figure and it is very accurate to all the new details in R1 armor, even the black body suit is ribbed!, the lenses are painted very dark green not black, the ear bumps are very accurate, Ab buttons are Rogue One accurate, straight tube stripes not curved that are actually in the correct location and accurately indented, and narrow drop boxes! It's actually impressively accurate. The jet pack is interesting as it remains to be seen if jump troopers will even be in the movie or not, it almost appears to be inspired by the jet packs in the latest Star Wars Battlefront video game but it's actually designed after the jet packs worn by the Sky Troopers that appear in the Disney Star Tours II 3-D attraction ride http://www.figures.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=94272&stc=1&d=1370539070. The figure even has a holster that the blaster fits in, but speaking of the blaster unfortunately it doesn't have the flashlight. A mold from another ANH figure seems to have been used. The "Saga Legends" series included this exact same blaster before Disney acquired Lucasfilm. Here is the figure I believe that blaster mold was designed for; the 3-3/4" Saga Legends SL-11 figure. Below is the 12" (1:6 scale) version of that same figure, but notice the blaster is a ROTJ style E-11. Evidence that Lucasfilm wasn't always exactly 100% accurate with their toys even before Disney acquired them. Clearly ANH Stormtrooper with a ROTJ blaster, that's not even allowed by 501st standards.

That is great, very good to see a rouge one blaster being offered! Question: Where can I order a set of these power cylinders? from you? I'm using all real parts. I already own the airsoft sterling, flashlight and all the other components, I just need a good casting of these power cylinders now.

Hey Christopher what's up I'm definitely interested in a set of these Power Cylinders! I'm not sure if you're already aware of this or not but the origin of these power cylinders have been identified over on the RPF. They are resin casts of the power cylinders that come included on the Shepperton Design Studios E-11 blaster (http://www.originalstormtrooper.com) which is actually known as a pretty inaccurate blaster here on the forums, they come up for sale now and then. His armor is also not well received here on whitearmor or within the FSID. Kind of a crazy coincidence his power cylinders are used in Rogue One considering Andrew Ainsworth is the one who originally produced the screen used stormtrooper armor for ANH, and even more intriguing considering the Lucasfilm lawsuit over production and public sale of his stormtrooper armor.

I don't think it was ever confirmed to be a black ALICE Pack, somebody that attended CE just said "It was definitely black at Celebration" meaning that it was definitely black on the display, not that it was originally black. It has already been confirmed to be a USGI issue Large OD Green ALICE Pack dyed black. https://www.facebook.com/PartsofSW/photos/ms.c.eJwzNDCwNDI2NrEwtTAztTQ20jOECBhaGJkaG5kZWQIAcSIGqw~-~-.bps.a.1004258153030132.1073741862.193037424152213/1009233485865932/?type=3&theater

I just found this and I thought I should post it here, this photo was taken from directly inside the Lucasfilm Archives, straight from the Photo References Gallery here on FSID. Notice the "pushed in" teeth on the left side of the frown, perhaps it's possible this was the bucket used for recasting? I do know ANOVOS was given access to the Lucasfilm archives to produce their kits, and that they used pieces from several different suits to recast their armor.

Looking closely at the straps holding down the main flap of the ALICE pack they do not appear to be the original straps that come on the pack. The straps that normally come included on ALICE packs are usually made of 25mm Nylon webbing, where as these appear to be 25mm Polypropylene webbing. Probably the most common type of webbing available. If you look at the comparison photo below it's clear to see that the original Nylon webbing in the left image does not match the webbing in the right image, neither in weave pattern nor color. Both images are taken from the same photo of the same prop yet the image on the right appears to be Black 25mm Polypropylene webbing. Notice the ends of the straps are fraying and not sewn similar to the cotton straps holing down the "sleeping bag/tent cover" this along with the fact that the original buckles were replaced may indicate the straps themselves were also replaced. Notice the significant difference in weave pattern, also the colors do not match exactly. In the left image the original ALICE pack straps are OD Green Nylon dyed black which explains the greenish patches, you can also see the threading used to sew the straps is still OD Green so obviously it did not take to the dye very well. The image on the right appears to be plain black webbing, Polypropylene and Polyester synthetics are stain resistant and do not take dye very well if at all, this fact combined with the consistent black color and distinctive weave pattern lead me to believe the original ALICE pack main straps were replaced with Black 25mm Polypropylene Webbing. Perhaps the strongest evidence of the main straps being replaced is the removal of the straps from the bottom of the pack, these are usually sewn in place from front to back and they appear to have been completely removed! This would require a seam ripper to tear out the threads in order to completely remove the straps on the bottom of the pack. Last but not least here is a confirmed photo I took of a Nylon strap from a USGI ALICE Pack on the left (undyed), and common 25mm Black Polypropylene Webbing on the right. Don't just take my word for it, google images of polypropylene webbing and judge for yourself. Pay attention to the weave pattern. Black 25mm Polypropylene Webbing from Google images;

Looking forward to your findings on the ALICE Pack and Shoulder Straps. Patiently waiting... P.S. I believe I may have identified the type of tubing used for the antenna "cable". I'd like to share my observations with you.

I messaged the eBay supplier for the 25mm Antique Brass webbing gliders, he informed me they should be back in stock in 2-3 weeks. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Molded-solid-cast-adjuster-slide-buckles-strap-suspender-webbing-glide-ladder-/181396564350?var=&hash=item2a3c13e97e:m:mkAxrN4GZW1Wo4ODNaTCBpw

You're Very Welcome. Don't purchase anything unless you know for sure it is the correct part, you will waste your money. Brian you will need more than 5 Webbing Gliders, there are 4 on the front of the main flap alone, 2 securing the bottom of the ALICE Pack to the frame, and possibly 2 more securing the top of the ALICE pack to the frame. Maybe it's your spelling, I'm not even sure what you're referring to but I don't believe any additional strapping is needed other than the Olive Drab Cotton Webbing. Have you ordered the main components to the pack? Swedish M-75 Military Back Pack, Norwegian Grenade Case, U.S.G.I. ALICE Pack, Woodland Camo Enhanced Shoulder Straps?

You will need more than 5 Webbing Gliders. There are 4 on the front of the main flap alone! then two securing the bottom of the ALICE pack to the M-75 frame, and possibly 2 more securing the top of the ALICE pack to the M-75 frame. I don't believe any additional strapping is needed other than the Cotton OD Green Webbing. Also your list is missing some main key components shown in the first post of this thread. Unless you have already bought those you will obviously need to order them too; Frame, Ammo Box, ALICE Pack, Shoulder Straps...

You're very welcome Yes the stock on all these items started to dwindle the moment I posted that, Lol. I identified and sourced all these found parts by myself but I am 100% positive of their accuracy after hours of research. I ordered all my stuff before posting that so there was still plenty of stock in all these items at the time. But I know there are other sources for these items available out there, they just have to be found The Sleeping Bag/Gun Case/Canvas Roll/Tent Case has yet to be identified and confirmed.

No the straps and buckles are not taken from the M75 Swedish Hiking Pack, they're sourced separately. The Buckles used to hold the sleeping bag to the Norwegian Grenade Case are known as "25mm Cam Buckles" used for cargo strapping. These are the 230 pound rated cam buckles, NOT the 550Lbs. Notice the thickness of the metal. I found these right here in Canada but they are available elsewhere just be sure to buy the correct size/rating if you want it to be accurate: http://www.hudson4supplies.com/metal-hardware/metal-cam-buckle/cam-buckle-1-in-230-lbs.html The Buckles holding the main flap down on the ALICE pack are known as 25mm "Strap Adjusters" or "Slide Buckles" or "Webbing Gliders" or "Ladder Lock Buckles" . These same buckles were also used to mount the ALICE pack to the M75 frame. These are the 25mm Antique Brass finish: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/181396564350?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&var=480379766443&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT And Here in the UK: http://www.greengrizzly.co.uk/en/roller-buckles-belt-loops-/1740-molded-solid-cast-adjuster-slide-buckles-strap-suspender-webbing-glide-ladder.html?ps_mobile_site=1 The Strapping used to hold the Sleeping Bag to the Norwegian Grenade Case is "25mm Olive Drab Cotton Webbing" Notice the strapping is dark in photographs, so I ordered Dark Olive Drab as opposed to light olive drab. What I received appears to be 100% accurate in terms of color and weave pattern of this webbing. The thickness and fraying characteristics are definitely those of cotton and not polypropylene or nylon. Here's where I purchased my strapping: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/10-yards-Color-Choice-25mm-1-Cotton-Webbing-Belting-Belt-Fabric-Strap-2mm-Thick-/112001206744?var=410943130054&hash=item1a13cac9d8:m:ml_wrqXZsuUDtHo83RUkCSA

If you're going to change the radius on side two maybe try to use the red side of the capacitor on the left side of this image as an example, the edge is also a bit sharper on the red side than it is on the black.

Last week I received my Metalmite capacitor replicas in the mail, after customs held them for two weeks. Even though my real capacitors are slightly different size and type I told Chris I would take some comparison photos anyways. Here are Chris' replicas next to my real vintage capacitors. Aaron's photos serve as a better comparison than mine as his capacitors are the same type CP30S where are mine are type CP31N.

Wow! that is some very thorough research. Very interesting stuff! I spent some time searching for the origin of this greeblie myself with no success. I think it's pretty cool that the prop makers were able to use WWII items just like in the OT. Now that it's 2016 these things look even more like they're from a galaxy far far away, and definitely from a long time ago! To most people now a days this is a completely unrecognizable part, which is obviously what the prop makers were going for. I bought one of these hook greeblies from Paul and I now have it in hand. My two cents on the Female Hook Component; Judging by the small inner hook clearance when opening and closing the spring loaded lever I think it's possible that it was meant to hook onto a small steel cable of some kind maybe? or a small steel bar. Whatever point it was meant to hook onto can't be very big.

Check it out: http://www.sideshowtoy.com/collectibles/star-wars-stormtrooper-jedha-patrol-tk-14057-hot-toys-902873/?scid=TREV011&utm_source=bronto&utm_medium=email&utm_term=Image+-+TK-14057&utm_content=Image+-+TK-14057&utm_campaign=101816distributednews#&gid=1&pid=5'>http://www.sideshowtoy.com/collectibles/star-wars-stormtrooper-jedha-patrol-tk-14057-hot-toys-902873/?scid=TREV011&utm_source=bronto&utm_medium=email&utm_term=Image+-+TK-14057&utm_content=Image+-+TK-14057&utm_campaign=101816distributednews#&gid=1&pid=5

It doesn't get any more authentic than using real genuine parts, it's literally the same thing the actors held on screen.

Chris when posting pics here on the forum, just click on the small image icon at the top of the text box and copy and paste the image link into the pop up window. Then your images will display directly here in your build thread.

Okay I thought that photo was just meant to show the difference in shelf depth and I just happened to notice the different angle braces. I figured you probably already noticed that I just didn't see any mention of it. I thought the weld points on the webbing mounts were interesting too, definitely worth noting which is why I decided to come forward. Although the weld points may vary, I agree that the angle of the webbing mounts is more important and they still match yours. My frame supports the theory this angle was consistent in production of the M75. As opposed to LK35 webbing mounts which were made more perpendicular to the frame posts like you said. Anyways I can't wait for the next update. Very much looking forward it.

I really hate to challenge your findings as I am intently following this thread and eagerly awaiting future updates to this build. It is not my intention to be disruptive or argumentative. Although I do feel obligated to point out something I may have discovered, I could be way off on this but the team working on this build may appreciate me bringing this forward. At least I hope... I agree 100% that the prop at CE used an M75 frame. As you said the evidence is not overwhelming but I feel the light grey end caps on the top of the frame posts are a pretty dead giveaway if you ask me. Here's the M75 frame I bought. I purchased this frame from Coleman's Military Surplus. As stated earlier it is advertised as an LK35 on their website, but an M75 is pictured and that is what I received as you can see above. I have found evidence that suggests not all M75 frames had the lower webbing mounts welded "in line" with the frame but rather more on the outside similar to the LK35, or on the outer edge at the very least. Clearly the frame used on that particular prop at CE had them welded in line, but this proves they may not have all been like that. As you can see here, it's kind of welded more on the outer edge/upper corner of the bar, not completely on the "outside" like the LK35. But definitely NOT in line with the frame. Please let me know what you think of this. Also in terms of construction; I may have found another way to distinguish the two different frames apart aside from the Shelf Depth and Frame Height. Unless this was already discussed somewhere and I just missed it. As you can see below the angle brace meets at the bend on the LK35, and on the M75 it does not.

I actually just watched Fury the other day, what a coincidence. I was going to say you can see these periscopes in a lot of scenes in that movie. For anyone who hasn't seen it I suggest checking it out. Good story focusing on a Sherman tank crew, starring Brad Pitt but the rest of the crew are great actors too.